2025 Race Talk

bulletbass man
Posts
920
Joined
8/18/2018
Location
Collegeville, PA US
Fantasy
169th
10/19/2024 4:40am
Eae903 wrote:
That's not necessarily better for the riders though. What if Lachlan doesn't do nearly as well next year? A team signs him based off of this...

That's not necessarily better for the riders though. What if Lachlan doesn't do nearly as well next year? A team signs him based off of this year's performance, he has a bad year next year, and then he's dumped because he couldn't bring in the points the team needs to maintain their status. It's far better for the riders for teams to sign them for multiple years, to help develop them and allow them time to get better. Another great example is Ryan Pinkerton, dude killed it in Juniors, super confident on that GT and then he went to Mondraker in elites and just did not have the year I think most people were expecting from him. I think he hasn't been getting along with the bike as well, but we know that it's not a bad bike give Dak and Dunne's killer season. He has the time to improve and get better and get more used to the bike without having to look for a new team right away since Mondraker isn't at risk of not being able to compete in world cups next year. 

veefour wrote:
This is one of the issues I have with WBD's "clear pathway" claims. Outside of the spots for nationals and continental series it's going to be...

This is one of the issues I have with WBD's "clear pathway" claims. Outside of the spots for nationals and continental series it's going to be hard to progress as the riders on teams competing in the big league will be under contract. So if teams don't have the additional funds required to add riders to their roster they either have to cancel those existing contracts or the up coming rider has to wait for a contract to end and a spot to open upon a given team (possibly leading to shorter contracts becoming the norm). Either way it's bad for riders in general IMO.

Agreed.  It ultimately will consolidate a lot of power into the hands of teams with top riders.  But I don’t think it really will help those top riders come contract time as it would be very hard for a new team to sign several points scoring riders even if they have the budget (as opposed to one big name and a couple development/recovering riders.  The one exception being the national, world, continental champion rule(assuming that includes former champions)  As those riders can essentially circumvent elite/wildcard team status and still be guaranteed being able to race.  Giving someone like Reece Wilson or Aaron gwin the ability to focus on themselves with their own program and sponsors of their choice.  But realistically they already had that opportunity.  But compare to someone just as talented who has podiumed on world cups but not won a championship and they may have to take less money to guarantee themselves elite status.  Especially after a mediocre or injured season.


Personally I think it’s a pretty moronic way to go about things.  I’d much rather see the world cups open to most people.  Add a playoff for the last few rounds with a smaller field.  At least then you’d add excitement and hopefully bring in/back a few of the eyeballs that you are turning away by cutting participation.


 

1
Oli_C
Posts
24
Joined
11/11/2020
Location
FR
Fantasy
1229th
10/21/2024 1:03pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2024 1:05pm

ah I think they also got the wrong end of the stick, ramp-age is everywhere.



(disclaimer, this is only a small part of the track we have seen, the tunnel is closed, so I can't go by easily to check the probably horrifically steep trail, hopefully it will produce close 3 minute racing for the masses)

1
veefour
Posts
556
Joined
7/31/2016
Location
Cinderford GB
Fantasy
268th
10/21/2024 1:47pm Edited Date/Time 10/21/2024 1:48pm
Oli_C wrote:
ah I think they also got the wrong end of the stick, ramp-age is everywhere.(disclaimer, this is only a small part of the track we have...

ah I think they also got the wrong end of the stick, ramp-age is everywhere.



(disclaimer, this is only a small part of the track we have seen, the tunnel is closed, so I can't go by easily to check the probably horrifically steep trail, hopefully it will produce close 3 minute racing for the masses)

Yes, if it comes down under the lift or somewhere near to it the lower section of the track won't be short on gradient.

noodlenosteeze
Posts
153
Joined
1/12/2023
Location
Magna, UT US
Fantasy
1675th
10/22/2024 10:57am Edited Date/Time 10/22/2024 10:58am

Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster Energy DH series in 2025, and potentially a World Cup stop by 2027. Anybody heard anything similar? Would love to see some DH racing close to me. They're really gearing toward putting a full bike park in to compete with other nearby parks, so it definitely seems possible.

1
10/22/2024 11:27am
Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster...

Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster Energy DH series in 2025, and potentially a World Cup stop by 2027. Anybody heard anything similar? Would love to see some DH racing close to me. They're really gearing toward putting a full bike park in to compete with other nearby parks, so it definitely seems possible.

That is a wild rumor. If any resort(s) in Utah were set-up to host a large bike event it would be Deer Valley (ultimately the same corporate overlords as Solitude, Alterra) or Park City (Vail Resorts).

Solitude has limited parking, limited accommodations, and limited restaurants. Everyone would need to stay in Salt Lake Valley and drive 30-40 minutes up each day. Doesn't make much logistical sense.

Super intersted to see if this has any legs.

2
noodlenosteeze
Posts
153
Joined
1/12/2023
Location
Magna, UT US
Fantasy
1675th
10/22/2024 11:40am
Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster...

Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster Energy DH series in 2025, and potentially a World Cup stop by 2027. Anybody heard anything similar? Would love to see some DH racing close to me. They're really gearing toward putting a full bike park in to compete with other nearby parks, so it definitely seems possible.

Buckets Up wrote:
That is a wild rumor. If any resort(s) in Utah were set-up to host a large bike event it would be Deer Valley (ultimately the same...

That is a wild rumor. If any resort(s) in Utah were set-up to host a large bike event it would be Deer Valley (ultimately the same corporate overlords as Solitude, Alterra) or Park City (Vail Resorts).

Solitude has limited parking, limited accommodations, and limited restaurants. Everyone would need to stay in Salt Lake Valley and drive 30-40 minutes up each day. Doesn't make much logistical sense.

Super intersted to see if this has any legs.

Yeah - trail builder friend of mine has been working with the trail crew advising on some new features and plans and he heard it there. AFAIK Deer Valley has no interest in hosting summer cycling events, They've denied a few potential stops to reuse the old Nats racetrack. Nothing's been done since the Scott Enduro Cup shut down in 2018/19. 

 With parking and in-resort amenities I agree. Solitude could host a US Open and smaller DH series but they'd need to put in work for a World Cup. The terrain would make for a pretty sweet race though.

1
Pappas717
Posts
3
Joined
1/13/2022
Location
Port Washington, NY US
10/22/2024 4:22pm
Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster...

Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster Energy DH series in 2025, and potentially a World Cup stop by 2027. Anybody heard anything similar? Would love to see some DH racing close to me. They're really gearing toward putting a full bike park in to compete with other nearby parks, so it definitely seems possible.

The 2025 Monster series will look pretty much the same, Big things coming for 2026. 

ride
Posts
70
Joined
8/4/2009
Location
Bellinghome, WA US
10/22/2024 5:24pm

Clay Harper and Chris Ball have separately visited a site(s) near SLC recently. 

1
Mr.Nally
Posts
381
Joined
1/2/2021
Location
AS
10/22/2024 11:53pm
ride wrote:

Clay Harper and Chris Ball have separately visited a site(s) near SLC recently. 

That's cool. More top tier racing in North America the better 

Eae903
Posts
124
Joined
10/20/2023
Location
Laramie, WY US
10/23/2024 7:44am
ride wrote:

Clay Harper and Chris Ball have separately visited a site(s) near SLC recently. 

Mr.Nally wrote:

That's cool. More top tier racing in North America the better 

I haven't had an opportunity to ride there but I am pumped that solitude is actually putting in the work for a bike park. The University of Utah cycling club might be trying to host a collegiate race there next year hopefully, I've been trying to put some pressure on them to make it happen haha. 

1
NY_Star
Posts
43
Joined
11/28/2010
Location
US
11/7/2024 8:07am Edited Date/Time 11/7/2024 8:08am



BK off to INDONESIA to chase UCI points. Wild that is what it has come to for team spots for next year.

6
dwhere
Posts
56
Joined
10/5/2023
Location
dirty, DE US
Fantasy
185th
11/7/2024 9:07am
Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster...

Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster Energy DH series in 2025, and potentially a World Cup stop by 2027. Anybody heard anything similar? Would love to see some DH racing close to me. They're really gearing toward putting a full bike park in to compete with other nearby parks, so it definitely seems possible.

Pappas717 wrote:

The 2025 Monster series will look pretty much the same, Big things coming for 2026. 

Speaking of Monster, when are we getting a 2025 calendar release? With DH SE and the WC calendars already out, I trying to make some travel plans. 

Mr.Nally
Posts
381
Joined
1/2/2021
Location
AS
11/7/2024 9:17am
dwhere wrote:
Speaking of Monster, when are we getting a 2025 calendar release? With DH SE and the WC calendars already out, I trying to make some travel...

Speaking of Monster, when are we getting a 2025 calendar release? With DH SE and the WC calendars already out, I trying to make some travel plans. 

Surely you gotta blame WarnerBros ... 😀😋

4
LePigPen
Posts
381
Joined
12/23/2020
Location
Harbor City, CA US
Fantasy
151st
11/7/2024 9:28am
NY_Star wrote:



BK off to INDONESIA to chase UCI points. Wild that is what it has come to for team spots for next year.

I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues where last years riders wont be on that team?

I'm still iffy on understanding the sort of exceptions/wild card rules they have that would allow someone like Asa to stay on Frameworks even if the team isn't quite qualifying on points. Tho I also heard they are making some valuable team changes to seek outright qualification.

I know it shouldn't be an actual issue, but I do feel bad that some riders may be seen as 'point pawns' in this qualification scheme. Hopefully it isn't valuable enough for bad faith actors to pick up a certain rider and effectively ignore them all season.

4
11/7/2024 10:56am Edited Date/Time 11/7/2024 11:09am
NY_Star wrote:



BK off to INDONESIA to chase UCI points. Wild that is what it has come to for team spots for next year.

LePigPen wrote:
I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues...

I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues where last years riders wont be on that team?

I'm still iffy on understanding the sort of exceptions/wild card rules they have that would allow someone like Asa to stay on Frameworks even if the team isn't quite qualifying on points. Tho I also heard they are making some valuable team changes to seek outright qualification.

I know it shouldn't be an actual issue, but I do feel bad that some riders may be seen as 'point pawns' in this qualification scheme. Hopefully it isn't valuable enough for bad faith actors to pick up a certain rider and effectively ignore them all season.

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically a few teams could come out of "nowhere" with big-points signings that push Pivot out of the top 15.

BK didn't have a great season, Jake, Dane, and Ryan all earned points but there's a rumor that Jake and Dane are going to Norco. I don't think Jenna, Morgane, Teagan, Matt, or Eddie earned any points that contribute to the DH team rankings.

If I were in spots 11-15 in the potential mtb elite team rankings, I'd definitely be out there securing extra points to try to make sure I don't get nudged out by some other team stacking up points.

I think the smartest thing a team could do right now would be to sign a top-10 woman and a national federation champs winner from one of the less--currently-represented-in-the-DH World Cup federations.

8
LePigPen
Posts
381
Joined
12/23/2020
Location
Harbor City, CA US
Fantasy
151st
11/7/2024 11:08am

I know it sounds dumb but I wonder if that means, for the 'next' season... The points totals should be derived from the teams previous season points to avoid or offset this kind of behavior. But I know the companies would absolutely dog pile on a rule like that to stifle it since it would make it very hard to... Well, rig the system if need be.

I dunno it clearly shouldn't be a big deal I just feel grossed out by the grabbing riders for points just to stay in narrative. Which probly isn't happening as much as I'm making it out to be. But in a system where it's already punishing to qualify and finance and all that... Having one more gong show rule to punish lower riders is just frustrating. In any event I do hope this elevates national races.

11/7/2024 11:38am

The GOAT said in the newest Pinkbike podcast that Norco will have "a couple of new riders". Not that much info, but it could support the Jewett brothers claim. Although Norco needs more riders no matter what. 

bulletbass man
Posts
920
Joined
8/18/2018
Location
Collegeville, PA US
Fantasy
169th
11/7/2024 11:39am
Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster...

Heard through the grapevine that Solitude Mountain Resort local to me is trying to get infrastructure in place for the US Open and a stop Monster Energy DH series in 2025, and potentially a World Cup stop by 2027. Anybody heard anything similar? Would love to see some DH racing close to me. They're really gearing toward putting a full bike park in to compete with other nearby parks, so it definitely seems possible.

Pappas717 wrote:

The 2025 Monster series will look pretty much the same, Big things coming for 2026. 

dwhere wrote:
Speaking of Monster, when are we getting a 2025 calendar release? With DH SE and the WC calendars already out, I trying to make some travel...

Speaking of Monster, when are we getting a 2025 calendar release? With DH SE and the WC calendars already out, I trying to make some travel plans. 

No real information.  But I’d assume a feb/early march race in rock creek and Memorial Day at mt creek to start the season again.

hogfly
Posts
320
Joined
2/10/2020
Location
Fayetteville, AR US
Fantasy
1725th
11/7/2024 11:52am
The GOAT said in the newest Pinkbike podcast that Norco will have "a couple of new riders". Not that much info, but it could support the...

The GOAT said in the newest Pinkbike podcast that Norco will have "a couple of new riders". Not that much info, but it could support the Jewett brothers claim. Although Norco needs more riders no matter what. 

In the Between the Numbers podcast, he also mentioned spreading them out evenly among the various practice groups to make it easier on mechanical support.

11/7/2024 2:14pm Edited Date/Time 11/7/2024 2:19pm
NY_Star wrote:



BK off to INDONESIA to chase UCI points. Wild that is what it has come to for team spots for next year.

LePigPen wrote:
I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues...

I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues where last years riders wont be on that team?

I'm still iffy on understanding the sort of exceptions/wild card rules they have that would allow someone like Asa to stay on Frameworks even if the team isn't quite qualifying on points. Tho I also heard they are making some valuable team changes to seek outright qualification.

I know it shouldn't be an actual issue, but I do feel bad that some riders may be seen as 'point pawns' in this qualification scheme. Hopefully it isn't valuable enough for bad faith actors to pick up a certain rider and effectively ignore them all season.

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically...

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically a few teams could come out of "nowhere" with big-points signings that push Pivot out of the top 15.

BK didn't have a great season, Jake, Dane, and Ryan all earned points but there's a rumor that Jake and Dane are going to Norco. I don't think Jenna, Morgane, Teagan, Matt, or Eddie earned any points that contribute to the DH team rankings.

If I were in spots 11-15 in the potential mtb elite team rankings, I'd definitely be out there securing extra points to try to make sure I don't get nudged out by some other team stacking up points.

I think the smartest thing a team could do right now would be to sign a top-10 woman and a national federation champs winner from one of the less--currently-represented-in-the-DH World Cup federations.

I certainly hope not, but Pivot seems to be in a spot of trouble if they need to send two riders across the globe to chase 2x 60 UCI points :/

There's another race in Indonesia soon, Class 2 (30 points for 1st), wondering if they'll try and fish those points too.

1
RadAxSmirch
Posts
82
Joined
12/31/2018
Location
FR
Fantasy
170th
11/8/2024 1:35am Edited Date/Time 11/8/2024 1:38am
NY_Star wrote:



BK off to INDONESIA to chase UCI points. Wild that is what it has come to for team spots for next year.

LePigPen wrote:
I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues...

I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues where last years riders wont be on that team?

I'm still iffy on understanding the sort of exceptions/wild card rules they have that would allow someone like Asa to stay on Frameworks even if the team isn't quite qualifying on points. Tho I also heard they are making some valuable team changes to seek outright qualification.

I know it shouldn't be an actual issue, but I do feel bad that some riders may be seen as 'point pawns' in this qualification scheme. Hopefully it isn't valuable enough for bad faith actors to pick up a certain rider and effectively ignore them all season.

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically...

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically a few teams could come out of "nowhere" with big-points signings that push Pivot out of the top 15.

BK didn't have a great season, Jake, Dane, and Ryan all earned points but there's a rumor that Jake and Dane are going to Norco. I don't think Jenna, Morgane, Teagan, Matt, or Eddie earned any points that contribute to the DH team rankings.

If I were in spots 11-15 in the potential mtb elite team rankings, I'd definitely be out there securing extra points to try to make sure I don't get nudged out by some other team stacking up points.

I think the smartest thing a team could do right now would be to sign a top-10 woman and a national federation champs winner from one of the less--currently-represented-in-the-DH World Cup federations.

Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. 

As BK usually winters in NZ and Indonesia is on the way over, why not do some bike tourism, open up to new markets and gather a few points whilst you're at it? It's a very Bernard thing to do. I mean, you would too, right?

If the world cup is truly going global, I'd expect a round in that part of the world happening in the not so distant future. Who has the most elevation, Indonesia or the Philippines?

2
11/8/2024 1:51am
LePigPen wrote:
I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues...

I would have thought that team is well enough to qualify. Are they just off the mark or something? Or... Is this also related to issues where last years riders wont be on that team?

I'm still iffy on understanding the sort of exceptions/wild card rules they have that would allow someone like Asa to stay on Frameworks even if the team isn't quite qualifying on points. Tho I also heard they are making some valuable team changes to seek outright qualification.

I know it shouldn't be an actual issue, but I do feel bad that some riders may be seen as 'point pawns' in this qualification scheme. Hopefully it isn't valuable enough for bad faith actors to pick up a certain rider and effectively ignore them all season.

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically...

I would imagine Pivot would be ok if nothing were in flux...but teams are still signing/losing riders (or haven't announced the riders they've signed) so theoretically a few teams could come out of "nowhere" with big-points signings that push Pivot out of the top 15.

BK didn't have a great season, Jake, Dane, and Ryan all earned points but there's a rumor that Jake and Dane are going to Norco. I don't think Jenna, Morgane, Teagan, Matt, or Eddie earned any points that contribute to the DH team rankings.

If I were in spots 11-15 in the potential mtb elite team rankings, I'd definitely be out there securing extra points to try to make sure I don't get nudged out by some other team stacking up points.

I think the smartest thing a team could do right now would be to sign a top-10 woman and a national federation champs winner from one of the less--currently-represented-in-the-DH World Cup federations.

Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. As BK...

Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. 

As BK usually winters in NZ and Indonesia is on the way over, why not do some bike tourism, open up to new markets and gather a few points whilst you're at it? It's a very Bernard thing to do. I mean, you would too, right?

If the world cup is truly going global, I'd expect a round in that part of the world happening in the not so distant future. Who has the most elevation, Indonesia or the Philippines?

Both country's have some decent size hills, and looking on the map the's certainly areas with enough elevation to play with just oustide Manila.
The Philippines has a pretty fun local DH scene.
One of the Zerode team riders Bryn has raced there a few times and seems to love it.

11/8/2024 9:13am
Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. As BK...

Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. 

As BK usually winters in NZ and Indonesia is on the way over, why not do some bike tourism, open up to new markets and gather a few points whilst you're at it? It's a very Bernard thing to do. I mean, you would too, right?

If the world cup is truly going global, I'd expect a round in that part of the world happening in the not so distant future. Who has the most elevation, Indonesia or the Philippines?

It makes complete sense, for sure. That's kind of what I'm getting at.

If it is Gravity points and not just DH points that's great for PFR (and Yeti but that's a different conversation, maybe). One podcast I listened to makes it sound like it's Gravity points, one makes it sound like it's DH. I think that's the crux of the problem: what exactly will it be? I could definitely see stacking some extra points up as a "why not?" sort of thing...especially if there's some uncertainty in if/where they'll land in that top 15 or if some of those details aren't 100% known to everyone yet (the teams might know already - some of the teams? all of the teams? only the top 15 elite teams? who knows what?).

2
veefour
Posts
556
Joined
7/31/2016
Location
Cinderford GB
Fantasy
268th
11/10/2024 4:25am
Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. As BK...

Gravity points, not DH points as I understand it, so for the time being, Morgane is the most valuable asset in the team, points wise. 

As BK usually winters in NZ and Indonesia is on the way over, why not do some bike tourism, open up to new markets and gather a few points whilst you're at it? It's a very Bernard thing to do. I mean, you would too, right?

If the world cup is truly going global, I'd expect a round in that part of the world happening in the not so distant future. Who has the most elevation, Indonesia or the Philippines?

Looks like the trip was worthwhile with a win for BK and fourth for Jenna.

I'd be surprised if they don't return to the UK for a while before travelling to NZ, it'd be very early in their season compared to previous years and what most riders seem to do.

Indonesia's highest mountain (4884m) has more elevation than Mont Blanc and is nearly 2000 metres higher than anything in the Phillippines, although with the highest point being at just under 3000 metres (2954m) I would imagine the Phillippines also has plenty of suitable terrain.

11/13/2024 12:54pm
BGoldstone wrote:

That's damn near the entire world cup top 20 men and top 10 women! (Minus the Frenchies for some reason)

2
veefour
Posts
556
Joined
7/31/2016
Location
Cinderford GB
Fantasy
268th
11/13/2024 1:20pm Edited Date/Time 11/13/2024 2:45pm

That's damn near the entire world cup top 20 men and top 10 women! (Minus the Frenchies for some reason)

I remember hearing last year that Loic wanted to race but Specialized Gravity weren't keen to let him. I wonder if he (and maybe Finn) would like to be there this year, but the same thing happening?

sspomer
Posts
4879
Joined
6/26/2009
Location
Boise, ID US
Fantasy
66th
11/13/2024 1:28pm

here's the podcast w/ warner and eliot about the roster. gonna be a good one!

 

1

Post a reply to: 2025 Race Talk

The Latest